Your NED Career Move

In this episode of The Potentia Playbook for CFOs, Dominique speaks to former CFO and now portfolio Non-Executive Director, Anna Sedgley, about the journey from executive leadership to the boardroom. Anna shares the pivotal moves that shaped her career, the power of sponsorship, and her practical three-year framework for succeeding in senior roles. She also offers a clear-eyed view of what it really takes to secure NED positions and why they rarely happen overnight.

They explore burnout, financial readiness before stepping away from executive life, and the shift from operational delivery to governance and oversight. Anna is candid about imposter syndrome, using AI to stay sharp, embracing gender as a strength, and choosing purpose-led roles in the non-profit sector. A grounded, practical conversation for CFOs thinking about what comes next.

Transcript

SPEAKER_01 0:09

So, Dominique, we've got Anna in the studio with us this afternoon. Um, what are you going to be speaking to her about?

SPEAKER_03 0:14

Yeah, so Anna Sedgley, incredible woman. Um, and for our listeners today, we are going to be exploring the role of CFO into NED. So I know lots of people are keen to get those NED roles, and Anna's going to talk a bit more about how she got it, and hopefully, we can understand a bit more about what it takes to be a good NED.

SPEAKER_01 0:31

Yeah, absolutely. And you know, most women that I speak to or to be honest, any finance leader is constantly looking up and going, how do I get there? How do I go there?

SPEAKER_03 0:40

Anna will shortly tell us. Fantastic. Brilliant. So we are here today with the amazing Anna Sedgley. Anna, thank you for coming. Ah, thanks for having me, Dominique. You're welcome. Um, so please, Anna, tell us a little bit about you, who you are, where you are at the moment, and what you're up to.

SPEAKER_02 0:56

So I am a child accountant. I was a CFO and a COO, and I'm now mainly an NED, non-executive director. And I'm really looking forward to our chat today, Dominique, um, to talk about how I became an NED. It's something that I would have loved to have heard a few years ago and sharing it with our potential community.

SPEAKER_03 1:18

Oh, amazing. I think people will be delighted and privileged to hear it. But let's start at the beginning. Okay. How did you get to be a CFO? It was probably an interesting story right there.

SPEAKER_02 1:28

Yeah, uh, so I suppose the pivotal moment was uh joining Sky and about the year 2000 it was. And back then Sky only had two and a half, three million customers. So it was at a time where the business was really growing a lot. And the Sky Finance team, I think, is widely recognized as being very innovative in the program that they run because we were able to rotate to all parts of the business. So I felt that I got FBA experience in the arts. So I looked after Sky One and Sky News for a period of time. I got experience in the technology and engineering side of the business, um, in group, which is its own thing again, as all of the finance people on this listening will know. Um, and then I ended up being the finance director for the customer group, which was the call centers, the supply chain, um, and then of course the marketing and the subscriber responsibility. So I learned a huge amount in a very short amount of time in a really fast-paced, demanding company. And then um my husband got a job in the United States, and I was really lucky because I was with Newscore, who owned Sky at the time. They arranged for me to move um to a company that they had just purchased there called Dow Jones. And Newscorps had bought that because they were after the Wall Street Journal, which is sort of the main asset, um, or was the main asset at the time of Dell Jones. And really, I had a couple of years out. Um, I was working part-time for Dell Jones, and uh I was sort of resettling our family because we'd moved. Um, and then when we took the decision to stay in the US, that's when I got really serious about accelerating my career again. After it wasn't a full break, it was only actually eight weeks, I think, break, um, but but sort of part-time um for about a year and a half. And then I became deputy CFO, uh, and then I became CFO. So it it didn't happen as I would have planned it in my head because it happened in the US. Um, and I think that's one of my um sort of proudest days, actually, was standing on the pavement uh of Sixth Avenue looking at 1211, the building I was in, you know, looking up to the skyscraper and thinking, oh my god, I'm from South Australia. I'm now CFO of a business here in New York. So that was that was a pretty wild day. Um, and that's how that's how I got CFO. So I'm telling you all the good bits. Um there are a lot of uh, I like to say snakes and ladders. I've just given you a shortcut on the ladders on how I got to CFO, but there were a lot of snakes along the way as well.

SPEAKER_03 4:14

We should definitely talk about the snakes, but I can imagine that you, I don't know how old you would have been, but like looking up with a new family kind of transitioned over to the US and then looking up at this building. Um, bloody hell.

SPEAKER_02 4:24

What have I done?

SPEAKER_03 4:26

I've got to go in there now and do the job. But yeah, it worked out. So tell me then. So there obviously were some ladders, um, but I think probably self-made ladders that don't just they don't just pop out of nowhere. So tell me about the ladders. What were the big kind of pivotal moments that really propelled you, you think, to that?

SPEAKER_02 4:42

I think the most important ladders were ones that were put there for me by somebody I'd already done a good job for or with. Um, so again, one of my um good friends who used to work with me used to say that he used an analogy of like mountain climbing where you're all chained together and as everybody rises, they pull everybody up behind them. And so I was really fortunate to, well, I was fortunate, plus I worked hard at it, um, to develop relationships with people who uh were also heading places. And so twice, in fact, two of my biggest appointments, um, first into finance director at Sky, and I was the first female to take that role, and then the CFO role, both came out of the blue because both um had business partners who had said that they wanted me to be their their finance person, um, and they insisted upon it. And so, you know, in the years that preceded that, where I was working hard for them and, you know, getting along well with them, and and we worked together and solved lots of problems. I didn't have an expectation um that they would create opportunities for me, but that's that is how it happened. So um I think it's always really important to make sure you're working with people who enjoy providing opportunities for people around them. I think that's kind of the takeaway. And I was really lucky because that's the culture of News Core.

SPEAKER_03 6:20

And it's probably relatively fortunate that they were of high caliber and were going places, but please don't underestimate you. That's not just luck, that's because of your hard craft and your just pulled anybody up.

SPEAKER_02 6:32

So yeah, I mean it's it was it true. Yeah, yeah, true. I mean, I always thought like I'll just take the next job. Um, I had this rule as I was going up the ladders, uh, always say yes. Yeah. So every time I was offered something, even if it was a great inconvenience, I would say yes. Um, and now with hindsight, you know, that possibly wasn't necessary. And that I also not everybody listening to this should adopt that same philosophy. Um, but that was what I had in my head. If I'm offered something, I'm saying yes and I'll work out how to manage it later. And then I thought I will just keep going until there's a job I can't do. And when I hit the job that I can't do, or when it's too much, I I'll say I'm ready to stop. Um, and so yeah, so the ladders came and and you know, you have to work very hard when you're in a in a step up every time. Um, but then after I always think one year to scramble, one year to improve, one year to look for what's next. Yeah, three years, you should look for your next year.

SPEAKER_03 7:42

I always think in threes. I hadn't learned those threes. I love that. I love that. So one year to scramble, which was what get to grips with everything.

SPEAKER_02 7:48

Get to grips with everything, next year to fix it and significantly improve it. Year three, enjoy and look for what's next.

SPEAKER_03 7:55

Love that. I love that. So talk to me that you mentioned the NED roles. Yes. And that's something that we're really keen to explore in these series. And lots of CFOs are really keen, myself included, how to become this NED. So tell us, you've currently got a few NED roles. I do. I have five things now.

SPEAKER_02 8:11

So um the first one came after I'd left News Corps, and um, it was actually when I was still in the US, and I think it was at the beginning of the pandemic. Um, and at News Corps, there was actually a policy that you weren't able to take um outside board roles. That was a, and I don't know if it still is, but that was a very, very firm policy. Um, I was able to take industry board roles while I was there, and so that's a good starting spot for people because often organizations where you're making donations or industry bodies, they'll often have a representative from the major companies on their trade board. So I was able to do um News Media Alliance uh and a couple of others in in the US, which I really enjoyed. And that gets you a little bit of your feet under the desk about process and and even about the we'll come back maybe to the dynamics of how you behave in a boardroom, but it's sort of safe starting place, if you will. Um, so I'd done a bit of that, but when I left News Corps, I became able to look at external things. And the first thing that sort of approached me was again through a ladder, actually, from somebody who had worked with me back in the year 2000 when I was an analyst at Sky. And you must have made a really good impression. Well, I don't know about that. I think I might have made a really bad one, Neil. I don't know. I have to ask Neil, but well, maybe I did in the end. Um, if he thought of me. So he was uh working in Sydney and um he works for a small family office or a family office investment um group, and uh they had taken a stake in a company in the US and they were thinking about going public in the US or in Australia, and I'm trip I'm actually triple citizen. So I had a passport in both citizenship in both locations. So, and they wanted somebody to chair an audit committee, and it wasn't yet public. So I was pretty well qualified, and I gave them optionality about where they would choose to list. Um, so that actually was um really unexpected windfall to get that role at Fiscal Note, and um that's been fantastic. I've been with them since um, I think it's four years now. Uh, and actually at the beginning we didn't get paid because we were um as directors, and that was fine because I was learning and and the board, um, some incredible board members to learn from in my first actual financial, you know, corporate board. Um, we have a professor from Stanford, we have a refused to be a professor at Stanford, um, a governor, uh, an amazing um military leader and some brilliant investors uh are on the board. So I was blessed to be in amazing company. And I think that's one thing to check. Like, who were the other board members? Are you going to learn from them? Um, that's part of your diligence about whether this is a good organization to join. Um and so fiscal note went public. Um, and that was incredible to be uh chairing the audit committee with all of the regulatory hurdles and steps that you had to do to IPO on the New York Stock Exchange. Or actually, we did a D SPAC on the New York Stock Exchange. Um, and then the step up from being a privately owned company to being a public company and what that means uh for financial reporting and audit. And now we're actually doing the next step step up on socks. Um, so that has been wonderful, and I've learned a huge amount, and I love working with them, and it's kept one foot for me in the US, which I'm really grateful for. I've never heard anyone so excited about socks. This is uh see, the fun thing is when you're an NED, like you don't do the socks. Yeah, you you check that the socks has been done and like you ask questions about the socks, you you dig into it, yeah um, and you're the world's biggest socks cheerleader for the team, and you are open ears to hear, you know. For example, I have a monthly call with the audit auditor, um, the partner and the senior manager, and they tell me what they think is going on, and then I'll speak to the CFO and the the finance director and make sure that I've got their side. And then we, you know, have quite frequent um audit committee meetings. So, you know, I hear things, but you know, I'm not actually doing the testing, I'm not actually building the controls. So um some of the some of the work that I've done earlier on in my career um is has been valuable because it all ladders up.

SPEAKER_03 13:06

As an NED, you must be, especially with the breadth of companies that you have, so many new things or things that haven't crossed your path before. How do you, without the sort of fear of imposter syndrome creeping in and this sort of uh how do you tackle these new things that you're coming across your desk?

SPEAKER_02 13:22

This might alienate you and some people listening. I try not to do imposter syndrome like when that I have lots of other problems, Dominique. I'm just not counting that one as being one of my problems. Um, so you know, when you get that little voice, oh, I shouldn't be here or whatever, I just you know, stop it because I think there's a difference between nerves and being sort of a bit anxious, excited, nervy about doing something. That is normal. I think that's a sign that you're doing the right thing because you're stretching your capabilities. 100%. What you don't follow that with is oh, I better step back. Yeah, I don't belong. That that's I do the first bit all the time. I try not to take myself back out of the game by talking myself out. So I'm I that's the one thing I'm quite strict with myself on. So um what I find is is I get a little bit more embarrassed. Like I I have to do a lot more of my own research, um, and thank goodness for AI, because that's made research so much. So much easier. So much easier. So much easier because I think when you're a CFO or an NED, like people expect you to be familiar with all of the acronyms and all of the you know technical standards, and and um we'll talk about it, but I've just been on on the board now of two um UK-based charities and a global um private public partnership board, and um that is a whole nother universe again. And I was actually at a charities um conference yesterday, and I know nothing about the charities commission. I mean, embarrassingly nothing. So I think rather than be um imposter, like I don't belong there. My head goes, wow, I'm really embarrassed. I don't know any of this. Like they're talking about charity swap, and I'm like, what? I I need to go away and do my own work. So long, short answer, you get caught out all the time. Um, I make frantic notes and go and teach myself everything. Sometimes if it's a meeting that you can have a laptop, I'm live learning. Yeah. Um, otherwise, I'll always go and follow up. And then, and or if it's critical for the conversation, I just ask.

SPEAKER_03 16:06

Yeah. I mean, um, you're making me feel so much better about my use of AI in meetings to understand what is that going to mean. I completely agree with you. I think it's really valuable. Yeah, I completely agree with you on imposter syndrome as well. For me, I don't get this. Oh gosh, I shouldn't be here. I get this, oh gosh, isn't this exciting that I'm learning? Like I love, I I and and instead of embarrassment, it's this like absolute desire to want to learn more. So I think I share that with you. Um, but I I I get a bit embarrassed if I was to tell you how much time I spend researching or like or like googling things and things like that. But um and AI has read things so much easier.

SPEAKER_02 16:38

It has. I mean, people just rattle off, like because uh one thing I've really make a point to remember. Actually, two things I make a very, very deliberate point to remember. One, somebody has spent 20, 50, 100 hours thinking about something, then they come and talk to you for about it for five minutes, and they expect you to understand what they've said and give them feedback.

SPEAKER_03 17:06

And probably 10 people have done that that day.

SPEAKER_02 17:08

Yeah, and they've had like a hundred hours to think about it. So there's a very um big gap. Um, I can't remember the phrase for it, but there's there's disproportionality and and knowledge there. And the other, the other thing when you look up is you only ever see the tip of the iceberg. There's so much more information that very senior people have that you you're not privy to. And that's true in the boardroom as well. So, for example, um I'll I'll use the the Global Alliance of Vaccines um GAVI, which I joined in January. Um, that is attended, uh, the board is is comprised of members from um the World Bank, um, from uh UNICEF, from um uh the Gates Foundation, governments, um, policy, it's public health, and I've only ever been a media CFO. So um I'm very, very much big farmer is there, small farmers there, um, I'm very much out of my comfort zone. Uh and then because I'm new, I'm just trying to play the new card in breaks and following up with people over coffees. Like, can you just explain that to me? Or, you know, follow-ups. Um I no one's born knowing everything.

SPEAKER_03 18:27

And I thank you for sharing with me about how you got into an NED role. Tell me, what made you, why did you stop being a CFO and move into NED work?

SPEAKER_02 18:36

I think I did it, I did a calculation that said I had done um a 37 and a half hour week times 40 years. I'd done that in 25 years. Oh gosh. And um so I was like, okay, I'm done, right? I just I just felt it. I just thought I'm done. I mean, I got uh personal finance advice beforehand because um you can jump back in after a couple of years, but I think after two years, maybe you're sort of a bit out of the the the um visibility, I suppose. Uh but I knew I had finished. Um, and I I knew I'd enjoyed doing fiscal notes so much that I wanted to do more things like that. Did you feel finished? Were you burnt out? Yeah, yeah. Um burnt out, yes, but I think that's not necessarily the best way to go. I think um I again talk about regrets. Uh I think it's better to go out on a high on your own terms. Um but we all know that exiting an organization is never that simple. Um, gone are the days of 65 and a watch and you know, a warm glass of wine in the office. Um so really now people move on when they're no longer the right person to take the the job forward. I felt that I in my last executive role, I'd done what I came to do. I hadn't completed it, but I'd put it onto the rails. Um, and I just felt tired. I just felt like I I've done it, I've got nothing more to learn or prove, or and I wanted to have a break and then turn to non-exec while I'm while I'm young enough to really enjoy it and have a decent career as a non-exec. Um, and so with fiscal note, um, I knew that I enjoyed it and I could do it. So I I did stop. I didn't look for another role. I was very um takes a lot of strength to say no to um to to interesting offers. Um, but I've held, I've held the line and said no to CFO roles. Um, and then it's just I think it's a a bit of a misunderstanding that non-exec director roles roll around quite quickly. They don't. Um, most boards only replace, you know, one person or two people every few years. So you can't really pick the boards and then aim the role. You've got to see what boards are are searching.

SPEAKER_00 21:17

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 21:18

Um, and I also made a big change um from the original plan, which was I decided to go into nonprofit, much more heavy into non-profit rather than for profit. And the reason was actually right now, twofold, 2000 uh 2024, and now there hasn't been much turnover in the UK PLC board um positions. Uh, so there's not a huge amount of vacancies out there. Um, I also felt that I had worked so hard for um very successful commercial organizations. I felt that it was time to do something more worthwhile to give back. And I also thought I want to be with people. The most important thing for me in my non-exec director search was to be in rooms that I've never been in before. And so Gavi is a great example of that. Um, I had never met anyone from UNICEF, which I think is just about the coolest organization in the world. So to actually be able to bring my finance skills and use that as my reason and my media skills to be um a seat at the table, that's just been a privilege. Uh and you know, Gavi vaccinates billions of children globally and saves millions of lives. So it doesn't really get better than that.

SPEAKER_03 22:39

That's amazing. That's amazing. So you feel like you've come full, full into Yeah, you don't get paid for these ones.

SPEAKER_02 22:44

I should just make that really clear to everybody. This is a labor of love. So you can't stop exec life until you've you've um done the run the spreadsheet on on get your financial advisor in. Getting your financial advisor in.

SPEAKER_03 22:59

But when you have, um it's really rewarding. So tell me then, Anna, what's next? It sounds like everything's super exciting. Yeah, just this. I'm really loving it.

SPEAKER_02 23:09

I'm meeting unbelievably different people. Um, it's given me time to do potential, which I am really enjoying meeting, working with all the women. Um, it's a great community. Uh, we've had a good time. And yeah, I'm just enjoying life. And when you're not in a full-time job, you get to enjoy the unseasonably warm weather, and you get to travel a bit more. You know, I've got family in lots of different places, and it's nice to be able to just jump on a plane and see them and work remotely all the time. And I'm never letting anyone down. I think when you've got a very large team or you know, CFO as well, you're always accountable directly daily to so many people, and that's a really heavy thing to carry. And I put that down now.

SPEAKER_03 24:00

Sounds amazing. I mean, it sounds hugely aspirational. Right. Anna, a quick question for you. I'm gonna ask all of our guests this. Okay. Do you think your gender has ever impacted your career, either positively or negatively? I think definitely, yes.

SPEAKER_02 24:13

Um, both. Uh I think it can be a negative um when you're stereotyped, particularly when you're younger and less accomplished. Um and again, back in the day, uh I know it's better now, but it it was pretty rough early on. Uh positively, I again, once I met reached a certain level of seniority, I thought I'm just gonna embrace being female and use that as a way of standing out. Um, and now actually there's women everywhere, and I've used it as a way of creating instant community, actually. So often if I'm in a room full of people I don't know. So again, I'll use a Gavi example, you know, room full of 50, 80 people I don't know, I tend to approach the women first. Um, and I think that we've kind of got a bit of a code because we've all been there. We all know how ghastly it is to stand by yourself. So um there's never a you'll never make a mistake if you walk up to a woman who's standing alone at a at a work event.

SPEAKER_03 25:19

I I've noticed I'm bumping into more and more the same women at the these events. Exactly. Yeah, we we do the full circle.

SPEAKER_02 25:25

Yeah, and um I just think you assume you have a sort of a meeting of the minds without even speaking.

SPEAKER_03 25:32

Yeah, absolutely. Um, thank you for that. Now, uh one other question for you before I let you go. I'm gonna send a bouquet of flowers so sweet to somebody of your choosing, uh, somebody that supported you, championed you, cheerleaded you. Who would you like me to send the flowers to?

SPEAKER_02 25:48

Uh well, this is a bit of a comedy answer um for people who know me who are listening. Um, and it's to uh a male colleague or a male boss I had, and his main thing that he taught me and many other women in the organization was that we had to care less. And it was a bit of a joke at the beginning. Um, but I think he found it as the only way to manage us because we would be so stressed about everything being perfect and working so hard. And and I guess he was sitting above where he could see how hard we were working and then see how hard some of our colleagues were working, and he would be like, they don't care as much as you. Like, what are you doing? And so, um, for over 20 years, I've received text messages, now WhatsApp messages every time I've had a work issue or crisis, and they just say care less. Um, and it's always made me laugh. Um, and there is some truth.

SPEAKER_00 26:52

I think I mean it of some truth in it.

SPEAKER_03 26:55

So I'm sure he'd love your flowers. Of course. Well, it's obviously served you very well. I think it's great advice. Uh, we'll get your name and address, and we'll make sure to speak. Thank you. Wonderful. Anna, thank you so much for joining us, and I look forward to speaking again soon. I look forward to listening to all of them. Thank you. So, Dominique, how did that go? What have you learned today from Anna? I really enjoyed it. Um, I hope the listeners did too. And uh yeah, so I learned there's this, I always think in threes, and Anna talked about three years in a role. I have done more than three years in a role, but she was talking about like the first year is the scramble. It's like where you make a bit of a mess. You get to grips with things, I think is what she's trying to say. The second year is about uh fixing and improving things, and then the third year about is enjoying and working out what's next. And I love that. For someone that thinks in threes, and for someone that's new in a job at the moment, I love the fact that not everything's gonna be fixed. I won't necessarily be enjoying it every day and nailing it, but that that's gonna come. This is your scramble, yeah. Yeah, I'm in my scramble. So for those of you in your scramble, uh it will come, I think, was what I took on that. So I love that. Um, and then the other thing I learned was I share this with her, is this sort of concept of imposter syndrome. I feel that often, oh gosh, I don't know what I'm doing, or I don't know what I'm, you know, what I'm supposed to do next. But Anna gave me this huge confidence that that's okay. Yeah, she's researching and Googling probably as much as I am, which is great. And the use of AI also in research. So that made me feel a lot better that I'm not sort of on my own there. And I hope that that's something people can feel when they're listening to our podcast as they're not on their own. Um, but also that when you are feeling that sort of imposter, what may feel an imposter, like to flip it and say, Well, this is a great learning experience. Yes. And I love that. I don't know if you've sort of spoken to Anna about that before, but I I love that.

SPEAKER_01 28:38

I haven't actually, that's not come up before. But again, lots of people that we that we meet with in our course of our jobs talk a lot about feeling imposter syndrome, especially after coming back from Matt Leave or I don't know, starting a new job, feeling like perhaps you don't fit because you don't know everything about what you're doing. And yeah, to to take it as rather than a negative, to flip it into a positive and go, no, it's okay.

SPEAKER_03 29:01

And to know that someone like Anna, CFO of the Dow Jones. Absolutely, uh, and that she feels like that, and that she flips it, and that's probably something that's driven so much success for her. Flipping it into I'm learning, I'm privileged to be in these rooms and have these great opportunities to learn. Uh so I that really resonated with me. I share, I share that with her. Sounds like a great takeaway. Yeah, super. I really enjoyed it. I just think she's a great guest. So I really enjoyed talking to Anna. I think we learnt a great deal. Um, I've certainly got thinking about sort of what it takes to be an NED, and uh I look forward to seeing you all again very soon. Thanks. Thanks again for hosting, Dominique. Oh, you're welcome. Thanks, Naris.